they didn’t read the room. I’m not a hobby farmer. And I’m not going lose money. When I signed up barley was £130 per tonne. And wheat £150.
AHL2 - Winter Bird Food
- Thread starter Stephensonlouis
- Start date
Steevo
Member
- Location
- Gloucestershire
Heard only 17% of farms have signed so far
.....and they are wanting 70% IIRC?
I think changing the rules may not have helped them in achieving their aims.
Seems crazy to be disuading people from entering the scheme when they are only about a quarter of the way towards their own targets.
Steevo
Member
- Location
- Gloucestershire
They may not be written, conscious 5-10 year plans.....but I think most people have a rough idea of what they are thinking e.g. wanting to expand, wanting to reduce, wanting to retire, wanting to plan for next generation, aware staff will soon be retiring etc.
We are all consciously and unconsciously juggling factors like this every day as in theory those are things we can control/affect by planning ahead.
Steevo
Member
- Location
- Gloucestershire
I also think there is another element too.
Most people make decisions based upon emotion....and then justify it with logic. We do what we WANT to do, and then explain why we did what we did.
On the basis that emotion does play a significant role, people want to feel safe, secure, content, happy, reassured, positive etc. and will look for options that provide/satisfy these emotions. Governments, policy etc. don't work on anything like this basis. They work on the idea of state control, regulation, restriction, coercion etc which make people feel the opposite of these i.e. fear, fright, guilt, shame, exploited, taken for a ride, blamed etc.
Like they say, you catch more flies with honey than vinegar. The carrot works better than the stick etc.
Steevo
Member
- Location
- Gloucestershire
Thinking about it a bit more.....@alomy75 suggests something has frightened "them" - I assume this was meaning "the government/DEFRA/RPA". Can these public bodies really get frightened.....? They are not human, but they are a collection of humans. A collection of humans who created a scheme to benefit the environment with a set of prescribed options. When people then take up these options in droves.....one would think if anything that they would be delighted.
If anything has frightened them, it could be suggested that that is due to their own perceived lack of control.....lack of control over the farmers and landowners that they drew the schemes up in order to be able to control.
If anything has frightened them, it could be suggested that that is due to their own perceived lack of control.....lack of control over the farmers and landowners that they drew the schemes up in order to be able to control.
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alomy75
Member
Yeah; ‘frightened’ of justifying to the government opposition why so much of the country is no longer producing food, frightened that they might have to go to the treasury cap in hand to ask for more money as take up has been too high…basically frightened that they ‘got it wrong’.
Steevo
Member
- Location
- Gloucestershire
It's interesting reading that....
"got it wrong" sums it up well. Like my Goldilocks analogy earlier.
Too little uptake - "government got it wrong"
Too much uptake, budget gone, electorate wonder why they are paying for flowers not food - "government got it wrong"
The above said - will governments (and public bodies) ever actually see that THEY got it wrong?!!
I think most government organisations are quick to blame it on someone or something else so that they don't have to take responsibility for it.
Maybe "fear of not being right" sums it up more. They have to maintain that fragile ego that tells them they can do no wrong at all costs.
- Location
- Lincolnshire
If was launched half baked.
And it has been set up to fit round a one size fits all IT system. CS has more human scrutiny before an application is accepted. That’s right in my view. The question could be asked along basic lines of is this sensible, is this value for money? With IT it tends to be garbage in garbage out. The Soviets would have been proud this. SFI sets us up also for eventual command ahd scrutiny of every detail of our businesses once they’ve recruited the army of inspectors they’ll need.
I’m staying out.
And it has been set up to fit round a one size fits all IT system. CS has more human scrutiny before an application is accepted. That’s right in my view. The question could be asked along basic lines of is this sensible, is this value for money? With IT it tends to be garbage in garbage out. The Soviets would have been proud this. SFI sets us up also for eventual command ahd scrutiny of every detail of our businesses once they’ve recruited the army of inspectors they’ll need.
I’m staying out.
Princess Pooper
Member
- Location
- East Mids
There was certainly talk locally of one chap who was going to put his entire 200 ha into wild bird seed.
- Location
- Essex
Don't think he's alone in that.
- Location
- Lincolnshire
I’m rsthwr pleased with my own voluntary area of heathland reversion. How much has it cost in time and money. Nothing of any significance. It’s has fairly well established after 7 years or so. Plenty of gorse flowers to keep the bees happy this spring. Silver birch growing as well as gorse and broom and plants u haven’t seen for years. It adjoins much older Heath next door so is largely self seeded. No diesel burns, no reports or consultants needed. Just stop mantling it. Hardly much production loss on that soil. Half an acre. I’ll expand it to an acre this year. I could claim but it’s just not worth the hassle. I’d rather just enjoy it as it is.
- Location
- Lincolnshire
The way I see it SFI is just another way to try to keep the air in the U.K. land and property bubble. Anything but allow the grand reset which would see values fall back to commercially sustainable levels for competition with global food production, allow new blood in, abandonment of some land to nature at no cost etc. But no we have to keep aristos afloat, over capitalised “agribusinesss” going etc that would otherwise succumb to commercial reality and leave us leaner and fitter and open up opportunity for those actually prepared to do an honest days work rather than just fill in a claim form.
Steevo
Member
- Location
- Gloucestershire
The best things are always one because people want to do it, rather than doing it for payment, credit or external validation.
Well done to you. It's good that you get to enjoy the fruits of your labour.
- Location
- Lincolnshire
I think so. Whenever the State seeks to command and control by financial inducement and regulation then all sorts of distortions and abuses occur. It’s refreshing to just do what’s best with what’s in front of us on the ground. I’ve ideas for productive watercourse buffer strips as well : meadow hay. No drama on cutting dates etc. Do it when it’s best. No long term commitments. Nobody breathing down your neck.
I’m reading a book called “What We Lost” about the decline of British industry during the last century in spite of or because of repeated government interventions. The parallels with what they did to British manufacturing industry then and what they are doing to British agriculture now are frightening. Throwing taxpayers money at things and micro managing from the centre rarely works in our long term interests but short term it shores up over extended and inefficient business for short term political expediency.
warksfarmer
Member
I've withdrawn 4 applications and rejected 2 offers but now finally done it. Decided to keep it simple and not bothered with anything to do with soils, hedgerows, nutrient management, integrated pest management except IPM1 and IPM4 which we have been doing for years anyway. No improved grassland options, no buffer strips, no farmland wildlife options except AHL2.
Just doing AHL2 on existing AB9 areas in a finished CS agreement plus some extra bits where cereals don't produce due to winter water logging because the Environment Agency wont clean the rivers out. IMP1 and 4 and thats it. Extremely simple and I'll add in the DD one in June.
Just doing AHL2 on existing AB9 areas in a finished CS agreement plus some extra bits where cereals don't produce due to winter water logging because the Environment Agency wont clean the rivers out. IMP1 and 4 and thats it. Extremely simple and I'll add in the DD one in June.
farmerm
Member
- Location
- Shropshire
Plant and go travel for 10 months, no capital in fert and chems, let the storage, gross >£100K, what’s not to like…. Aside from the weedy mess and the rats .
farmerm
Member
- Location
- Shropshire
A “reset” would see the end of family farms, abandonment of the hills and only a few surviving specialist producers operating less than 5000acs, 5000 ewes or 1000 cattle. I’ve no rush to see that become the commercial reality.
- Location
- Ceredigion
Is anyone doing this without Cereal in the mix
- Location
- Dorset/Wilts