Who's bottled it ?

[britt]

This year it's all down to drainage.
I have fields which normally do better on the flatter areas where the soil is better, but this year better on the slopes because it's drained better.
I have fields where you can see where all of the drains are because of a line of "normal" crop through a field that's generally poor and backward.
I Shakearated ground in the autumn before spring beans, this dried quicker than untouched stubble.
I have some rented ground with very poor drainage, this is still unplantable.
Most of my ground had been notill since 2009, but I have started to Shakearate in autumn before beans as a trial that I did showed that they did better than on untouched stubble. I'm now thinking that rotational subsoiling, or at least once, a few years into notill is necessary on our soils.
I may do some mole draining this autumn.
This has been the wettest 18 months on record since they began in 183?. So should we let it have too much influence on us ?

 

[Renaultman]

This year it's all down to drainage.
I have fields which normally do better on the flatter areas where the soil is better, but this year better on the slopes because it's drained better.
I have fields where you can see where all of the drains are because of a line of "normal" crop through a field that's generally poor and backward.
I Shakearated ground in the autumn before spring beans, this dried quicker than untouched stubble.
I have some rented ground with very poor drainage, this is still unplantable.
Most of my ground had been notill since 2009, but I have started to Shakearate in autumn before beans as a trial that I did showed that they did better than on untouched stubble. I'm now thinking that rotational subsoiling, or at least once, a few years into notill is necessary on our soils.
I may do some mole draining this autumn.
This has been the wettest 18 months on record since they began in 183?. So should we let it have too much influence on us ?

I'm thinking low disturbance subsoiling before OSR, and or beans
Winter beans DD don't look as well as those that went in min till this year but it could just be beans being beans. Last year DD winter beans worked well at home but not bon contract land.

 

[ajd132]

I'm thinking low disturbance subsoiling before OSR, and or beans
Winter beans DD don't look as well as those that went in min till this year but it could just be beans being beans. Last year DD winter beans worked well at home but not bon contract land.

I have one small field of proper no till beans that look shocking compared to min till or claydoned.

 

[4course]

I'm thinking low disturbance subsoiling before OSR, and or beans
Winter beans DD don't look as well as those that went in min till this year but it could just be beans being beans. Last year DD winter beans worked well at home but not bon contract land.

Im thinking similar but there is unlikely to be any osr sown in 24 here . Re subsoiling if its dry we will do the lot if we can ,riding round this last few months seems to me whatever method folk used and got fields sown before end of sept look reasonable. those in late sept early oct whatever method how they look is down to soil type . Those sown any later including me after the early days of oct what ever method is /was waterlogged as for the dd min till call it what you like most sown in oct look fairly poor and those who suffer with bg and or waited are whatever their chosen method are in the no crop re sow brigade regardless in many cases

 

[Two Tone]

I have one small field of proper no till beans that look shocking compared to min till or claydoned.

Believe it or not, my most successful (looking, so far!) Autumn planted crop is actually my Winter Beans, planted using @Warnesworth ’s Horsch C03 with the long, narrow Metcalfe coulter points.
No LD or any other subsoiling took place.
Apart from a few areas where they flooded, the crop is storming away!

The only trouble with beans is that as we all know, they are the ultimate ‘Wish you’ crop.
However, we also know that what makes them yield is rain at flowering.
…….. Guess what the weather is doing now for what is now the 11th month in a row here?

 

[Vader]

For a start, go and look at as many farms on similar soil types as you farm in your own locality, that are already doing it, to see Which DD drill might be he most suitable for you. That might actually mean having 2 types of DD drill.

Don't know anyone with similar soils DD to learn off.
I tried a couple of 1/2 fields in the past with demo drills. But 1 pass extra (terrano) gave better consistant crop.

Know of a couple of people who tried for 5+ years on similar soils but now work up as could not get a consistent crop.

 

[Two Tone]

Don't know anyone with similar soils DD to learn off.
I tried a couple of 1/2 fields in the past with demo drills. But 1 pass extra (terrano) gave better consistant crop.

Know of a couple of people who tried for 5+ years on similar soils but now work up as could not get a consistent crop.

I expect there are some who do DD in your area, but I wouldn’t know who.

It isn‘t easy, but there are some good advisors who can help.

However, it will never work for anybody unless they want it to work!

 

[Adeptandy]

I expect there are some who do DD in your area, but I wouldn’t know who.

It isn‘t easy, but there are some good advisors who can help.

However, it will never work for anybody unless they want it to work!

It’s even hard some years when you want it to work 🫣

 

[DrWazzock]

I expect there are some who do DD in your area, but I wouldn’t know who.

It isn‘t easy, but there are some good advisors who can help.

However, it will never work for anybody unless they want it to work!

We wanted it to work but ended up with the DD tail wagging the dog.
To make it work we had to:
Bale the straw and buy in more potash or move to spring drilling. Oh dear.
Drill everything by 3rd week of September or don’t drill at all. Hardly conducive to arable business survival here.
Order gallons of glyphosate and 24d as you slowly lose tge battle with cranesbill and rosebay willow herb.
Mess about with cover crops as if we haven’t enough to do after harvest, then have the faff of trying to drill into them.
This year we will plough everything, no messing about and get on earlyish with the drill. No dither, no need for optimism, gambling, or having to to want to make it work. It will just work even if if we are pessimistic and grumpy and we will at least know we tried our best and didn’t pee about.

 

[DrWazzock]

It might work reliably here if we went to all spring drilling as the straw toxins have broken down by then and you are drilling into drying rather than flooding conditions. But all spring drilling is hardly likely to bring home the bacon here if it left us with a warm fuzzy feeling. Existence borne of 15 years wanting to make it work, without throwing hundreds of thousands at it. I accept that.

 

[Two Tone]

Believe it or not, my most successful (looking, so far!) Autumn planted crop is actually my Winter Beans, planted using @Warnesworth ’s Horsch C03 with the long, narrow Metcalfe coulter points.
No LD or any other subsoiling took place.
Apart from a few areas where they flooded, the crop is storming away!

The only trouble with beans is that as we all know, they are the ultimate ‘Wish you’ crop.
However, we also know that what makes them yield is rain at flowering.
…….. Guess what the weather is doing now for what is now the 11th month in a row here?

Drilled 16th October with this.

Unsurprisingly not so good on the headlands, But quite happy with the rest of them.

 

[DrWazzock]

View attachment 1179782

Drilled 16th October with this.
View attachment 1179783
Unsurprisingly not so good on the headlands, But quite happy with the rest of them.

Good job. You sowed them with a drag. Is that really direct drilling?

 

[fudge]

Good job. You sowed them with a drag. Is that really direct drilling?

Any one pass system is Direct Drilling. The seed goes directly into the previous crop residue. Removing straw counts as a pass or three mind.

 

[DrWazzock]

Any one pass system is Direct Drilling. The seed goes directly into the previous crop residue. Removing straw counts as a pass or three mind.

So a seven leg subsoiler with OSR sorinkled behind the leg is DD bringing 300 hp to its knees in places is DD?

 

[Flatland guy]

Good job. You sowed them with a drag. Is that really direct drilling?

It possibly is direct drilling.... but it is certainly not no till drilling by my definition.

 

[DrWazzock]

It possibly is direct drilling.... but it is certainly not no till drilling by my definition.

It was the right decision on the day. That’s probably all that matters, whatever somebody decides to call it. Never say never. Never rule anything out. Avoid dogma and blind obedience to rules.

 

[Vader]

Any one pass system is Direct Drilling. The seed goes directly into the previous crop residue. Removing straw counts as a pass or three mind.

so if you removed straw you are not DD?

 

[fudge]

Yes why not? For true DD all crop residue should remain in the field. I could by wrong though

 

[Renaultman]

It possibly is direct drilling.... but it is certainly not no till drilling by my definition.

What if you use LD legs?

 

[Two Tone]

so if you removed straw you are not DD?

Why is it not DD?
We need the straw here and it all comes back as FYM.

It possibly is direct drilling.... but it is certainly not no till drilling by my definition.

I’d agree with you to a certain extend, insofar that the only ‘no’ till there is, is broadcasting seed onto the soil surface.

However, this is not no-till, it is Direct Drillling. Meaning the seed is planted Directly into the previous crop’s stubble, without that soil being disturbed prior to the seed coulter (or disc) attached to which is the seed delivery hose.

Good job. You sowed them with a drag. Is that really direct drilling?

Yes, it is a Horsch C03 Drill with Metcalfe DD tines, designed to drill straight into the previous crop stubble.
In this case for Beans using the Metcalfe long, narrow tines.

For cereals an alternative Metcalfe wide, (underground broadcasting) tine is used:

This is because, especially with Spring Barley, rows that are too far apart could cause any ‘brackled’ ears to fall directly onto the ground, below where the Combine knife could pick them up, rather than lean against the side of the next seed row’s straw.